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Sorry, Socal Peeps! :(

By February 26, 2009Personal

16 Comments

  • Leilani says:

    I just placed an order for your workshop book a couple of day ago. I’m so exicted to read it, but I didn’t find anywhere on the order form when I could expect delivery. Any delivery dates????

    Love from Michigan!!

  • Divas says:

    Hey Leilani! Here’s a helpful link w/ info on your order: https://theboudoirdivas.com/#/contact-orders/
    Thanks for your order… we’d love to hear what you think after you read through it!!!

  • Tiffany says:

    Yes, but you should just not allow the community of San Diego, cause thats your 20 mile radius – which is fair. But instead you’ve given a 200 mile radius – completely unfair. Yes, it is your business model – but if your model is so good, and if you are TRUELY great photographers, you wouldn’t have to worry about the competition.

    If your book is as great as you say it is, thus proving your business model is as great as it is, then you SHOULD be able to sell it to SoCal – cause all great business models have /getting/, and /keeping clients/. If selling to the rest of the 200 mile radius ruins your chances of getting a job in Orange County or Los Angeles, then obviously your model isn’t as good as you say it is, cause your model would cover the whole thing about the competition. So basically you’re ripping people off.

    But I digress, I cannot afford your books anyways, because the prices are for people who already HAVE money, so helping people with lots of money earn MORE money – great job! I still think that the books are a bit of a rip off for the price – spiral bound, less than half an inch thick for the BOTH of them, for $300? That’s completely unheard of, and in the book publishing industry you’d be laughed out of the office of whomever you were trying to pitch your book to. :-/

  • Divas says:

    I’m sorry you feel that way, Tiffany… thanks for sharing your thoughts with us. We will probably open it up to Socal in the future… just not now. Thanks! 🙂

  • Tiffany says:

    Thank you for being kind, listening, offering explanations, and etc. 😉 Just, basic marketing 101 sez that the most important thing isn’t getting clients and keeping your market free of competition, its /keeping/ them! Hence why coca cola and pepsi exist within the same world.

  • Danielle says:

    I’m so sorry you’re dealing with this girls. Don’t sweat it. You can’t make everybody happy and that’s just the way it is. You have an amazing product that you are offering that’s worth it’s weight in gold but is ridiculously affordable. I’m not sure why people are making such a stink about it, to me, it’s just common sense but whatever. Like I said on DWF, it’s not just ‘tips and tricks’ that you’d get at any random seminar, it’s very specific and it’s very complete.
    I get that you’re NOT worried about your competition, that’s silly. It’s the competition looking, sounding, feeling etc. EXACTLY like your business (which is possible given all the info you provide). Tips and tricks, no problems. but ALL the info you give would be too weird to have lots of people in SoCal have. Ugh, I don’t know. This is so silly, it totally makes sense and I wish you didn’t feel like you had to defend your position all the time. You girls ROCK my socks and I’m SO grateful for what you’ve helped me do. Hopefully people in SoCal will find another resource that gives helpful info but not specific business model info.

    Tiffany, the workshop book is something like $150 right now (sale I think) and it’s worth SO much more than that. I feel it’s a bit rude to say ‘you’re ripping people off’ if you’ve not seen the product. It’s packed with amazingly helpful information, so much so that I had NO questions when I was done with it. It’s so cheap and it’s worth so much more than it’s being sold for that I’m a little baffled by your response. If you are upset, that’s one thing but these girls have been nothing but giving and polite (WAY past the breaking point as far as I’m concerned) so the rudeness is a little bit much. I can’t believe they were still so polite so such a rude post. And believe me, nobody is laughing. In fact, people at their booth in Vegas were saying that they would have paid 5x what the book is going for. And I did NOT have a business when I started and I had no money. The investment was the best business decision I’ve ever made, hands down. With their help, I went from ZERO to 90 clients in under 10 months and I wasn’t even advertising. So if anybody DOESN’T think its worth it, that’s their opinion but experience tells me otherwise.

  • Wilson says:

    Diva’s- your too kind.
    Tiffany, I’m sorry but you are insane! Why would anyone choose to sell every piece of information on what makes their business unique and marketable to CREATE competition? As someone with a marketing degree, I would say that would be the absolute worst marketing agenda I’ve ever heard. And, yes- of course they have a 200 mile radius…they are SO good people drive from LA and everywhere else for divine pictures from the divas! Yes, the can blow away their competition-but that doesn’t mean they should seek to create it! I probably wouldn’t have even bothered to acknowledge your comment, but when you tell these two amazing and sweet women they are ripping people off, I couldn’t hold back. ABSURD.

  • Divas says:

    Ok ladies – thanks for your defense… you are so sweet. But we really don’t want to stir up a debate here! 🙂 We know that not everyone will agree with our decisions, and we are ok with that. Wish we could make everyone happy, but we just can’t – so we’ll leave it at that. 🙂 xoxo, K & M

  • Divas says:

    Tiffany, coke & pepsi… true, true… just not sure that Pepsi would give their recipe to Coca-Cola… 🙂 hmmm, I dunno, just thinking out loud. Or typing out loud, whatever. 🙂 We seriously wish you the very best! No hard feelings for sharing your thoughts; we’re always open to hearing feedback, whether good or bad.

  • Danielle says:

    ok, you’re officially on happy pills. If not, I have no idea how to explain your questionable amount of politeness. lol…. Seriously, you give me hope that I can one day be slightly less volatile. On second thought… Nah. I scrap when I see the need. That’s just me. But honestly, I totally admire how you handle yourselves. It’s really something amazing. Kudos and Bravo! And Hugs! – D (the unauthorized defender)

  • Holla Danielle and Wilson!

  • Tiffany says:

    I’m glad to see blind enthusiasm and the capitalistic way has taken the place of REAL art in all your young hearts.

    I received, for free, as a scholarship for my photos, a complete family portraiture program – the program itself was worth $1000 and had I been in a much better financial place at the time, I would have paid every cent. They gave away their business model, plus two thick books of pure marketing secrets. This $1000 series was about 8 thick binders full of poses, and information on how to start a business. The thinnest of these books was about twice as big as both the Diva’s guides together.

    And I mean, if the divas are really not that worried about someone buying their stuff, I’ve got friends in Norcal who are more than willing to purchase their books, scan it in, and start torrenting it for free. *shrugs* Freedom of expression, freedom of art.

  • Tiffany says:

    PS: I also have a marketing degree, which I got to stop the pure evil forces of marketing and I much more am for starting a complete society that is resource driven and free to the common man instead of money guzzling guzzling guzzling, so I apologize for my radical views about art being low cost to make so that way you don’t pass on horridly expensive prices to innocent young girls who just want to feel pretty for a day. I’m glad you all feel really good about taking a girl’s low self esteem and squeezing out every last drop of her money so she can take photos with you. I just have a problem with earning more money than you need, unless you’re Oprah or JK Rowling and give that excess money away to help get kids fed and 3rd world nations to a point where they can grow their own food. That’s /my/ goal – to be beyond pure ordinary and actually make a difference with my photos.

    But I figure most of you girls are more concerned with all the fatty money you get to keep from making girls feel “pretty” for a day – my job? To help girls see the inner beauty. Maybe that’s why I’m so frustrated with this system.

  • Divas says:

    Hi Tiffany,

    For the sake of freedom of expression, I am certainly going to leave your comments up here, although I really don’t want this blog to become a place of dissension and debate.

    You have a right to your opinions about us, and you have the freedom to express those opinions. Unfortunately, however, you do not know myself or Marissa personally, so some of the things you are saying are a bit off-base and unnecessarily critical. I think I may post something soon that addresses your erroneous opinion that we are doing this just for the money, and that we do not have a heart for other people around the world. This is an incorrect view, and I would be happy to share my heart and passions on the blog here, in order to explain to everyone part of WHY I do what I do. My life’s goal is to do whatever I can to help others and to fight against injustice. [My favorite quote is this one: “The best use of life is to use it for something that outlasts it.” – William James] I am no Oprah; I will never claim to be someone special or someone who will be able to impact the world or make a huge change… at the same time, though, I know that even small acts CAN make a difference. My heart’s desire is far from simply hoping to make money for myself. I will work on a blog post right now that expresses a little glimpse of my hopes and dreams for the future, so hopefully you and others will see that this is not about the ‘fatty money I get to keep’!

    Again, I realize that you and I do not agree on certain views, and I understand that you are not happy with some of our business policies and practices. Unfortunately we aren’t able to make everyone happy, and I know that not everyone will agree with us all of the time (and we’re ok with that fact). Like I mentioned in my email to you earlier this morning, we are open to hearing different views, however, we simply do not agree with some of your views, and we will leave it at that. We wish you the very best in your business, and I am sorry that you feel the way you do about Marissa and I. I probably won’t be able to say anything to change your mind, but I truly do believe that if you and I were able to sit down over a cup of coffee, we would probably be able to talk through some of these things, and we might even begin to see eye-to-eye on some of these points. 🙂 Anyway, I hope you have a great day, and we really do wish you the best with your business and the pursuit of your passion through art and photography!

    On a more serious note, please know that if your friends in Norcal do begin to give away our copyrighted material for free, our lawyer will vehemently pursue legal action. Thanks for understanding!

  • Tiffany says:

    I know, I know, I’m just a crazy gutter punk radical – so my views are a bit extreme, and throughout this whole thing you two have acted most admirably, in fact, I give you much kudos for it. Here are two: Kudos! Kudos!

    I also do not believe that you two are bad people in any way of the slightest, or even in fact, bad photographers – you two have great photos. And I had already assumed in my mind that you gave 10% of your earnings to your charity of your choice… and I especially love your talk about injustice, because frankly, I believe in the same thing, hence why I’ve been writing to you on behalf of an injustice I’ve felt – and seeing your explanations makes more sense, so thank you.

    The fact that you would put freedom of expression beyond anything else, I think that’s wonderful, and that gives me hope. Plus I know wot with owning your own studio and taking photos all over SoCal, must cost a lot of money to get to places, do things, hire people, and obviously you two have the know how.

    I think my /big/ problem – which isn’t really that big, and I comPLETELY understand your views, is that you’re giving away these things, these big secrets, and people are (as people have been quoting the “reason” you shouldn’t, from a marketing stand point, sell in SoCal) – are directly taking the stuff you’re doing and hands up copy it direct.

    Perhaps it worked once, but what I’d like to see is the encouragement to improve upon the original ideas instead of just getting it, er, hand fed. (Perhaps you have a secret “DivasSecrets” forum that I am not aware of, not being allowed to purchase your books).

    Maybe I’m just ever so slightly bitter because I myself cannot get my hands on this book until I get out of SoCal (yes, I am big enough to admit that, er, at least I try to be) – but tell me this – if people in SoCal, maybe lets say, you do it on a “by photography” basis, I dunno, give them a chance, maybe there would be some people you’d be willing to share your secrets with.

    By all means not myself, because I’m just going to do it the old trial-and-error way as I’ve done with everything else (learning photoshop, photography, dreamweaver, wordpress, etc.), but if there were people who stood out and could 1. do justice to your photography, and 2. work and make /your/ business model their /own/ business model – you lay the foundations, the basement, and then they build skyscrapers – instead of making the same classical Spanish architectural 1 story that you two have created through hard work – does this make sense?

    I can understand that if every tom, dick, and harry, got their hands on your book you’d see a lot of copycat businesses (I’d say, like McDonalds, a franchise, which is what I’ve seen this whole thing as) – for cheaper – but they wouldn’t be as great as your photos, and most of your clients come for the wonderful “brand name” you two have made for yourself.

    My thinking – and pardon my optimism – is that people wouldn’t charge as much and therefor would get a lot of people who cannot ever afford to get the specific “DIVAS” brand of photography – you however, would be not only left with your previous clients, but your clients friends, and their friends, and their friends…. yes? Isn’t this a structure you teach in your book (which is network marketing 101 but you know that).

    The other thing you’d be left with is the people who WANT to pay a lot of money for their photography. Oh yes, you know these people – people who think cheaper photography, no matter how the quality, will automatically mean “poorer quality” – so they will automatically purchase these high prices.

    However, I’m guessing this is also in your book, so these cheaper diva studios that my optimism created, might not exist (poof), or, what would also happen, is you raise your prices (which I’m certain have been increasingly grown steadily through the years anyways, as equipment and studios got nicer) and the people who have your business plan still charge the old prices, but your new Diva-branded clientele will gladly pay cause they could afford it before, and wouldn’t dare be seen without DIVA-branded photos, catch my drift?

    I would love to see your dreams and future and would gladly take you up on your coffee offer anytime you see fit, because you two seem like nice people, and I thank you because talking to you has made me realize what my own goals as a photographer are as well, as I’ve been having a bit of an “identity” crisis – please, do you two ever have this same thing? Mine has been happening due to a feeling of creating too much “fluff” and nothing of substance – as beauty photographers, do you two ever feel this way as well?

    Thanks again for being honest, open, and willing to hear my (sometimes unfounded) criticism, and hopefully your BNFs (big name fans for those of you not from the girl-eat-girl world of fandom) won’t eat me alive.

  • A Fan says:

    To Tiffany, Please take 5 or 10 mins to browse through these blog postings to see the heart and passion of a “diva” who is working hard to take a bite out of the injustice in this world.
    Please research a bit before spending time is writing a diatribe that is of questionable value in this discussion.
    NOTE: these are just a few of many such posts. Dig a bit deeper if you dare.
    http://kimberleewestblog.com/2008/12/21/africa/
    http://kimberleewestblog.com/2008/07/31/now-i-lay-me-down-to-sleep/
    http://kimberleewestblog.com/2008/12/15/gifts-that-give-back/
    http://kimberleewestblog.com/2009/01/03/more-from-africa/
    http://kimberleewestblog.com/2009/02/01/do-not-allow-your-dreams-to-be-silenced/

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